AMELIA SEARSON, HOST: Minister McCarthy, good morning to you.
MALARNDIRRI MCCARTHY, MINISTER FOR INDIGENOUS AUSTRALIANS: Good morning Amelia, and a big hello to your listeners, and I like the introduction there with someone saying that this isn't a budget for winners or losers, it's a budget for what's best for the nation and I would totally agree with that.
HOST: Minister, we heard just before the Prime Minister getting a bit hot under the collar saying he had no plans to change capital gains tax and negative gearing. Are older Territorians right to be feeling a bit duped today?
MINISTER: This was an important decision that was made by our government. Clearly the changes around the global situation, Amelia, have really impacted on many levels. And we've certainly had our Housing Minister in Clare O'Neil working to see not just supply in terms of the construction of houses across Australia, but we've heard convincingly from grandparents and parents and young people themselves how difficult it is for them to get into the market. So, we have had to make a change to our direction on a number of levels and we do see this as a critical change and we are asking Australians to stay with us on this.
HOST: The Government's spoken a lot about fairness, but our listeners have questions around who is getting a fair go with these changes. Norm in Rapid Creek texted in and said ‘this so-called intergenerational equity is just a tax on people that worked their absolute backsides off whilst supporting this country through already paid taxes. The millennials are now outnumbering the baby boomers and Gen X's and getting their votes is what this is all about. The aged are treated very poorly in this country and it's just another kick in the guts for the likes of those older generations. This is another Albo broken promise and it needs to seen that way.’ Malarndirri, are older and wealthier Australians being thrown under the budget bus here to shore up an increasingly powerful millennial vote?
MINISTER: Well, I'd certainly say to Norm in Rapid Creek that's not the case. We have worked significantly to improve the health of Australians right across the country, in particular there in the Northern Territory. I'm speaking to you from Canberra obviously and wish I was home right now in that beautiful weather, but if I can say to Norm and your listeners that our injection of support in the health system has been quite tremendous, in terms of the Urgent Care Clinics that we've rolled out across the country, in the Northern Territory alone we've seen even with the PBS in terms of prescriptions, 2 million prescriptions taken across the Territory that have reduced the costs for not only the elderly, but for all people, Amelia. And of course, the budget is a decision for us to make for the time being where we're at. I said at the beginning, the global shock and the fact that young Australians are finding it incredibly difficult to have a future in purchasing a home, and we've made these decisions based on that.
HOST: You're hearing from NT Senator Malarndirri McCarthy this morning. We're talking about the federal budget which was handed down last night. Senator, local economists are flagging changes could drive up rental prices in the Northern Territory where we have a severe housing shortage and incredibly low rental vacancy rate of 0.4%. Has any modelling been done on how these changes will land here and what measures will you have to manage this?
MINISTER: In terms of the Northern Territory, I'd actually be interested to hear from the real estate and from those in the housing industry there what they've seen with their modelling. What we've done nationally, Amelia, is acknowledged that we had to have these changes in terms of the capital gains tax, in terms of the negative gearing, and we know that over time the government's housing policies will put downward pressure on rents.
HOST: One of our listeners has texted in asking, ‘Can the Senator please explain the 30% death tax that it plans to impose on trusts set up under a person's will when they die?’
MINISTER: Well, look, I will say this, that in terms of the government making changes to trusts and I wouldn't use those words, Amelia, the introduction of a 30% minimum rate will mean a fairer and more sustainable rate of tax paid on discretionary trust income. So, currently the discretionary trusts allow some Australians, and they’re often high wealth individuals and families, to plan their tax affairs in ways that aren't available to most people. And these changes, Amelia, can I just stress to your listeners, they will come into effect on the 1st of July, 2028. So, we're still a few years out, but we want to give and flag our intentions.
HOST: You've taken a big political risk in overhauling negative gearing and capital gains tax for individuals. Why not use other levers like gas tax reform?
MINISTER: Well, we've certainly had to look at what we're doing in terms of the domestic gas reservation, Amelia. There's no doubt there has been really strong views around what should happen in terms of our gas in this country. This outcome, in terms of the budget with the domestic gas reservation scheme, is something that has been worked on for a long time. The reservation is going to require gas exporters to supply a proportion of their total production to the Australian market and that's equivalent to 20% of exports from the 1st of July 2027. And if I can go back to your first caller in around the budget, we know that there's going to be different views, there's different ways of doing things, but we have a Treasurer in Jim Chalmers and a Finance Minister in Katy Gallagher, this is their fifth budget. They know what they're doing, they recognise that not everyone is always going to be happy, but we have to do this for the overall good of the nation and this is the direction we've taken.
HOST: Community safety has been front of mind for Territorians. Where is the money to improve community safety in the NT, something that often has us in the national spotlight?
MINISTER: Well, we certainly provide significant funds to the Northern Territory Government. Nearly 80% of the Northern Territory Government budget does come from the Commonwealth, Amelia, and that is for the Northern Territory Government to take into account in terms of the safety of Territorians through policing, through emergency services, and we expect them to do that and do that well. I also, under my portfolio of Indigenous Affairs, have a direct connection with the Chief Minister in terms of policing in remote areas, in terms of safety for families out in the communities where we have what's called the Northern Territory Remote Aboriginal Investment, which is a significant investment into the Northern Territory Government and to the communities of the Northern Territory. And the first time we were able to do that with Aboriginal organisations across the Northern Territory was this year, and I'm very pleased with the input from the Aboriginal community sector on that.
HOST: One of our listeners has texted in and says, ‘The real problem with the tax changes is not that it's a broken promise, but that the changes will have the exact opposite effect to the stated goal. Rents will rise, housing will be less affordable.’ Is that something that you have considered, Senator?
MINISTER: Well, as I said in my previous response to that with you, we do expect that over time the government's housing policies will put that downward pressure on rents, Amelia, and that is what we will be watching very closely.
HOST: Would you introduce rent caps to stop profiteering?
MINISTER: At this point in time we're pleased with what we’ve put into the budget, Amelia. I think it's important to say and show the Australian people that housing is a critical aspect of this budget and we do want fairness in terms of all Australians, but in particular our young Australians.
HOST: The Commonwealth is continuing investment in the Northern Australia Infrastructure Facility (NAIF). Given the difficulty the NT has had in creating an ongoing pipeline of more large-scale infrastructure projects, did the Commonwealth consider investment in any major works directly?
MINISTER: Look, this is a conversation that the Infrastructure Minister, Catherine King, does have with the Northern Territory Government and Bill Yan, as the Treasurer and Infrastructure Minister. I do understand that in terms of the Northern Territory, an additional 24 million is going to go into the NT in terms of particular requests around the Bagot Road safety and capacity upgrades, but also the Darwin International Airport and RAAF base precinct, Amelia, and some of these requests are ones that have come from the Northern Territory Government.
HOST: The Commonwealth is continuing to fund Aboriginal Justice Agreement initiatives such as law and justice groups and peacemaking. The NT Government's commitment to these initiatives has been questioned recently. Do you feel the NTG are upholding their side of the bargain?
MINISTER: Well, I would always say to the Northern Territory Government that they must work with the sector, with the legal sector, but also with the Aboriginal community sector because there is absolute concern about the high rates of incarceration and the increasing push for more prisons, when we need to see the actual programs that assist people to remove them from the behaviours. Those at the lower scale of crime and obviously the more serious ones, in terms of what we've seen more recently in Alice Springs. We have to see that there is a clear program to assist offenders and those who've done their time, what happens when they come out, and these are things that I know that I've been speaking with the Northern Territory Government about. I've been working with Minister Steve Edgington in terms of trying to work with the Aboriginal community groups, with peacekeepers. We want to see those programs continue, especially in places like Yuendumu and in Alice Springs itself. I know that Larrakia Nation in Darwin needs a lot of support to assist them and it's important that the Northern Territory Government does work with these organisations.
HOST: My name is Amelia Searson and you're hearing from NT Senator Malarndirri McCarthy, who's also the Minister for Indigenous Australians. Senator, there doesn't appear to be any new funding for Territory homelands. Are you confident that the current funding arrangements are good enough?
MINISTER: We do want to see further work with the homelands. What I've been doing in terms of the remote communities, including homelands, is wanting to see the remote jobs program roll out. We have now increased from 3,000 to 6,000 more work and paid work with conditions, with superannuation, long service leave, sick leave, holiday pay, all of those entitlements that come with the dignity of work, Amelia, and I've seen that rolling out in our remote regions. I want to see more of that across areas like our homelands to assist people who really want to set up their own businesses, their own enterprises. There are many homelands that want to set up their own ranger groups. We've been able to roll out the ranger programs across Australia, but including in the Northern Territory. And I've been able to see that 1,000 of those positions have gone out across the country and wanted 700 of those specifically for women.
HOST: Moving on from the budget, Senator, yesterday we heard some very moving condolence motions in Federal Parliament. Why was that important for you?
MINISTER: Well, it was not so much about me, it was really about the families, Amelia. The Warlpiri families and also the Gurindji families of Wave Hill. This was something that I knew mattered for them. I'd spoken with them and continue to speak with them about how the Parliament should handle it without trying to politicise it, but also raise the awareness and the importance of the need to acknowledge the coming together of hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of people around Alice Springs from all walks of life and to thank them, the police and emergency services, the volunteers, people who just had no idea of these families, but wanted to be there and showed the absolute compassion. That was beautiful to see, but we didn't get the outcome that we wanted.
HOST: The NT has moved to make Aboriginal children safer with new laws introduced to Parliament. That's sparked concern from a coalition of legal groups in the NT concerning new child protection laws introduced to NT Parliament. One of the leading concerns is the removal of the Aboriginal Child Placement Principle. Do you share those concerns and will you be speaking to the Chief Minister about this?
MINISTER: I have certainly been aware of the debate that's going on in regards to the Child Placement Principle. As Co-Convenor on the Joint Council with the Coalition of Peaks, we have and continue to work with First Nations organisations on every level, not just in the child safety area, but also in housing, in jobs, in incarceration, and we know that the best outcome is when you work with Aboriginal families, not against them.
HOST: Quickly, before we head to the news, Senator, what levers can the Federal Government use to ensure that the NT Government is making laws that are in line with best practice when it comes to taking children away from their families and finding a safe space for them?
MINISTER: I think it's really important that the Northern Territory Ministers are always working with the stakeholders and listening to those who have the expertise in this space. We have legal professionals who are very concerned about the rising rates of incarceration and yet there seems to be a lack of programs to assist people. We have at places like Groote Eylandt, for example, Amelia, where you see a solid program of justice reinvestment, and I would like to see that emulated right across the Territory to assist people and to stop people going into prisons when they can have other programs to assist them, and life can be a lot better for everyone. Not just the families themselves, but also those who live there. I think in terms of the child safety situation, again, I would encourage Minister Robyn Cahill to be working with the Northern Territory Children's Commissioner, certainly with the National First Nations Children's Commissioner. I do think they are very much experts in this space, and of course, with SNAICC.
HOST: We've got about one minute before the news, Senator, but someone is asking if the $600 million allocated for hate speech and anti-Semitism will also address the racism towards First Nations people in the NT?
MINISTER: Well, I've actually called for an inquiry and there is an inquiry underway now by the Parliament into racism and hate speech. Please go online with the Australian Parliament, have a look at that inquiry and put in your submissions.
HOST: Minister, thank you so much for your time this morning.
MINISTER: No worries, Amelia. Thank you.