GREG JENNETT, HOST: Jumping back to where we started today, at the centre of the Prime Minister's Closing the Gap statement was the first major new commitment in indigenous affairs since the failed voice referendum. The announcement today was worth more than $700 million. Assistant Minister for Indigenous Australians, Malarndirri McCarthy had a lot to do with working it up, and she joined us from Darwin to explain it. Malarndirri McCarthy, you've heard and read the Closing the Gap statements from afar this year, all the way from Darwin. Thank you for joining us. At the centre of it, though, is a reinvigorated remote jobs and economic development program with a very large allocation of money attached by anyone's measure. More jobs promised. Where and when?
MALARNDIRRI MCCARTHY: A wonderful announcement by the Prime Minister, Greg, today, a much-needed announcement. We're certainly very thrilled in this part of the country. I've just come from the Stolen Generations, Northern Territory event at Charles Darwin University this morning. And talking about jobs, about work, about the future. So very exciting and looking forward to seeing this roll out across not only the Northern Territory, but indeed, the surrounding states.
JENNETT: What's the objective here? I understand a lot of the sectors that will be targeted to train people are meant to replace staff who would currently fly in and fly out of remote communities. But what sort of sectors are we talking about here?
MCCARTHY: Well, maybe if I just explain what the community development project or program is all about. It is a program that when we came to government in 2022, we said we would abolish Greg. We felt it wasn't working. We felt it was penalizing heavily on participants across Australia, but also it didn't have superannuation. It didn't have long service leave all the kind of entitlements that come with work. People were largely, you know in many places, just painting rocks or doing lawn mowing and very, very menial sort tasks. So, we wanted to actually drill down to what we could do with this program. And this program has had many iterations. If I can just sort of remind your audience, you know, even as far back as the 1990s, I was actually on the community development employment program, which was the first iteration of this. And that program was providing money to organizations in regional and remote Australia. And those organizations would then determine who they would employ, how they would employ, where they would employ. And it worked, you know, it worked. So, we'd like to see something similar to that in this program going forward.
JENNETT: I understand you were a beneficiary of it in the early years of your media career. You set up, I think a community radio station, didn't you?
MCCARTHY: I did. I was enormously proud to do that. And, it was back in my home community of Borroloola, to be able to set up community radio whilst I was working on the CDEP with the local organization there. And, you know, again, the local organization could work with the skills of the different people who needed jobs, and I was one of them at the time.
JENNETT: So, does that mean because it is so community led, that you, as a government are unable to put your finger on which sectors, that is to say, 'oh we aim to have X numbers of people in retail, and X number of people in the care sector? Is it truly laissez faire? Is it truly left to the community to direct all of those sectors and all of those numbers?
MCCARTHY: Well, what's exciting about this, Greg, is that you have the community. Yes, and they should be, at the table in these discussions. But you also have local government. The local government sector does need, a large cohort of employees, especially in our regional and rural areas, in the shires, in the regional councils. But I would also like to see the Chamber of Commerce involved, especially here in the Northern Territory. I'd like to see the hospitality industry involved. We have a great ranger of program that is working. We're doubling the number of rangers, so we can really do a broad sector. And even with the ranger's program, you know, surveillance of our coastlines, all of this can be incorporated, in this new plan going forward.
JENNETT: Now, I noticed you may not have heard of Senator, but Peter Dutton in his speech to the chamber after the Prime Minister tabled closing the gap, he said if almost three quarters of $1 billion is to be spent on a program, there must be guarantees, the 3000 jobs figure is achievable, rather than simply being a wishful target. Are there guarantees around that number? 3000?
MCCARTHY: Well, I certainly want to see it, Greg, I'm enormously proud of this announcement. And I'll be working very hard, in the areas that I have responsibility for. I want to see health workers and health clinicians involved in this. I want to see the care sector involved in this in terms of aged care, childcare. All of these are still very critical in our remote and regional communities, and they can be self-sustaining jobs.
JENNETT: Will they always require repeat dollops of Commonwealth cash and at $700 million for three years today? But do they get to a point where they are economically viable themselves?
MCCARTHY: Well, there's no doubt that for businesses to be able to grow from this kind of concept is important. We've seen in Wadeye, for example, with the green plum or the Kakadu plum, there have been businesses that have generated as a result of these kinds of programs, and I expect that that would be the case with these jobs going forward too Greg.
JENNETT: All right. Let's move on to another. I think you would highlight it is a very important initiative that was contained in the announcements today, unfortunately, set against the backdrop of continuing poor performance on closing the gap. But a National Commissioner for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Children and Families. What will this person do?
MCCARTHY: Well, this has been a call by the First Nations sector in particular, SNAICC, and I commend them for the work that they've done in this in this area and their advocacy. This will be an important role, and I'm looking forward to seeing, our government progress it. We've seen children's commissioners in every state and territory. It is important that we reduce the out-of-home care of First Nations people across Australia. That number has risen phenomenally, and we see the concerns that we have in the youth justice sector, in the homelessness sector, and I know that this will be an important task for whoever takes that role on.
JENNETT: And what sort of executive powers would they have over, family welfare offices, police in some cases to ensure that, you know, the right approach is taken to say, removal of children from a family setting. Is it a powerful position?
MCCARTHY: Well, I know that Minister Rishworth, who will have carriage of this in terms of the powers and the legislative process. I know that she's determined to see that this is an effective role, and that Children's Commissioner is able to see the reduction of the removal of First Nations children at the high rate that is happening, but also be able to provide and give solutions to where they should go next, for those who need so much support.
JENNETT: All right. And just a quick final observation from you, Malarndirri McCarthy on the Closing the Gaps targets. I brushed over them very lightly. And we are having other discussions in the program today, but no great sense of encouragement for you, is there?
MCCARTHY: Well, we have to take hope from what we can see is improving, but we've got a long way to go. Obviously, the structural change that the Productivity Commission referred to was what we tried to do with the referendum last year. We were unsuccessful with that. It is important that First Nations people are at the table and being involved in policies and decisions that impact them, so we will be working on that continuously.
JENNETT: All right, well no doubt you're doing that. And maybe it's fitting that you are out in the community having those conversations while we're listening to the Prime Minister and others here at Parliament House. We'll see you back here before too long. Senator.