JO LAVERTY, HOST: Later today we'll be able to read the official cases for and against the constitutional referendum on the Voice. The Australian Electoral Commission will distribute 12 million pamphlets across the nation with a 2,000 word essay for each case. Malarndirri McCarthy is the Federal Labor Senator for the Northern Territory. Good morning, Senator. Can you tell us what we can expect to see in the pamphlet?
NT SENATOR MALARNDIRRI MCCARTHY: Good morning, Jo. Good morning to your listeners. You'll see both the yes and no case in the pamphlets and it gives Australians an opportunity to have a good look at what both sides are saying. And in terms of the Yes case. We certainly encourage all Australians to read the pamphlets when they come out or have a look online.
LAVERTY: Would have such a hard time calling it a pamphlet when it's 2000 words. What exactly is included in it.
MCCARTHY: We are certainly going to read what we've been saying in terms of the discussion so far, Jo, and that is that this is a simple request by First Nations people. It has happened over a number of years when people gathered at Uluru in 2017 and even prior to that and the many dialogues that took place. So there will be an understanding of the reasons why this came about, that this is from First Nations people, Jo, and that it is about an advisory committee so that First Nations people can give advice to the parliament should the referendum go ahead on matters of legislation and policy that impact them.
LAVERTY: The last time I wrote a 2000 word essay, it took days and days. It was just me doing it. And they were, you know, obviously a few typos that slip through. So how is this particular very important essay constructed?
MCCARTHY: Well, I'll say this. If we'd gone over 2000, there'd be blank pages in the in the pamphlet. Let me tell you, the Australian Electoral Commission are very particular about the numbers. You certainly couldn't go over, that's for sure. And in terms of keeping it to the length, this was a conversation that had to occur, obviously with Indigenous Affairs Minister Linda Burney and colleagues in terms of the Attorney-General Mark Dreyfus. And we certainly sought the advice of those around us and in particular the Referendum Working Group. But at the end of the day, this was certainly put together by our side of politics.
LAVERTY: So it was just one person sitting at the laptop belting this out or all of you huddled around it.
MCCARTHY: I should correct myself there, actually, Jo. I just realized that's the work I did. But then Mark Dreyfus and Linda Burney also had to speak with those people who said yes in the Parliament. So, for example, the Teals who voted yes, Julian Leeser, who voted yes and he's a Liberal member of Parliament and Bridget Archer. So those people who voted yes to the constitutional alteration bill were very much a part of drafting this pamphlet. And that's the case also for those in the No camp. One of the things that the Parliament's very particular on is that if you vote yes or no to the constitutional alteration bill, then you can be a part of the yes or no pamphlet.
LAVERTY: So in terms of the word count, you've already said if you even went one word over, then you it wasn't going to be allowed. So what's the final word count for your essay.
MCCARTHY: 2000 but it was certainly below that. I think it was around 1900 and something. So we made sure that we fitted in well and truly into the space that was required. The other thing I have to mention here is that as part of going through the referendum machinery Act with pamphlets, they actually don't have to be factual. The Australian Electoral Commission cannot check whether they're factual or not. So it really will be down to ordinary Australians to just, you know, have a good look at what's being said.
LAVERTY: That seems to be a mistake, surely.
MCCARTHY: Yeah, look, there's certainly been a lot of conversations around that. But again, we're dealing with a structure and a system that that goes back to at 1901.
LAVERTY: Okay. Well, maybe we need to change the constitution around that. Now 2000 words, it's a lot of text to get through, even for English as a first language. How many languages are you going to have this translated into and including First Nations?
MCCARTHY: Yeah, no thats an important point. I certainly would like to make sure we know that we have over 100 Aboriginal languages here in the Northern Territory, so we will need the assistance of the Aboriginal Interpreter Service, but also the non-English speaking background in terms of Italian, Greek, Chinese, all of that as well. So we need the multicultural community and I know that the Yes campaign has sought that already. So if you go on to the Yes campaign website, they've been able to translate into numerous languages from across Australia, not just First Nations, but obviously non-English speaking background languages as well.
LAVERTY: Well, it's a tricky task. And the Opposition Northern Territory Senator Jacinta Price said this.
PRICE GRAB: If you don't know, simply vote no. That is that is a key message also going forward. You know, you certainly wouldn't purchase a vehicle without seeing it first. So if you don't know the detail, vote no.
LAVERTY: Well, it's an easy argument to understand. And recent polls have shown that the no campaign is gaining ground. Are you worried?
PRICE GRAB: It's interesting. They use the vehicle, you know, sort of example, Jo. I would say that if I had troubles with my car, I'd go to a mechanic who knows how to fix it. And this is really what the vehicle of the voice would be, is parliaments haven't got it right in terms of First Nations people. So go to the people who do know and can give you the solutions. And that's what we're asking with a voice to be enshrined in the Constitution.
LAVERTY: Part of the concern is just how much influence those who say they have the solution will have on legislation at the highest level. Just how much influence will they have, Senator?
MCCARTHY: Well, the influence will come down to the representatives on the Voice if we're successful in this referendum. We are speaking to First nations people across the country. We know that over 80% of First Nations people do support the push for a voice. And we have put that in the pamphlet that people will read. So we're very aware that there is a great deal of interest in this and that there will be a responsibility on people who are on the voice to be able to push the case to improve the lives of First Nations people.
LAVERTY: And just finally, the No campaign have said they're targeting people who also voted no in the marriage equality plebiscite and they're mobilizing Christian lobbies. How do you feel personally about that approach?
MCCARTHY: Well, my approach is that this is about optimism and hope for a better Australia, for a better future. I don't want to say our future Australian generations have to deal with closing the gap, have to deal with the high rates of suicide and health and unemployment and educational conditions that we see with closing the gap as recent as last week. I don't want that to be on our future Australians and this is our country's opportunity to make that difference.