KATIE WOOLF, HOST: Such a busy time, I would imagine, because as we know, the Prime Minister announced the polling day for the Indigenous voice to Parliament referendum. It's happening on October 14th.
NT SENATOR MALARNDIRRI MCCARTHY: So yesterday was 45 days to the polling day, so I guess it's 44 days today and just encourage Territorians to get yourselves involved. This is democracy in action. We very rarely have referendums, Katie. We have a lot of elections and I'm sure your listeners would think that there's way too many elections but this is a pretty special referendum and just ask your listeners to get yourselves informed.
WOOLF: There's so many people on both sides of, you know, of the discussion here. There's some people who are so passionately for the voice. There's some who are so passionately against and there's so many who are just in the middle feeling quite confused, to be honest.
MCCARTHY: Yes. And this is the time, Katie, if I can just really encourage your listeners. This is the time now to get yourselves informed. There's so many areas you can. You can go to the Australian Electoral Commission website. You can certainly go to the NIAA website to understand about referendums, to understand what and why there is a referendum underway now. And then of course you can go to the Yes websites and no doubt there is a No one. So I think that this is a time for everyone to just get yourselves informed. But can I just really reiterate, Katie, and I've done this from the get go, it's really important that we're respectful in our discussions. I cannot emphasize that enough. One of the beautiful things about our country is we are a democracy and we can agree to disagree and we must do so I think always mindful of the fact that other people won't think the way we do, but we don't have to throw it down their faces and we don't have to have a go at them in really awful ways. And I just encourage people to just listen to one another or just say, you know, I don't agree with you, but that's okay.
WOOLF: Yeah, I think exactly the same. Educate yourself, make your own decision. But you don't actually need to fight with people over your decision or the way in which you're going to vote. That is the beauty of the country that we live in, is that we can all make informed votes ourselves, and it's safe to do so.
MCCARTHY: Absolutely. And you know what? When you go in the ballot box to vote, it's just you, you know, and you know, it's your private, personal decision, whichever way you go. So there are some people who will be very passionate and outspoken and love to speak for it. I'm certainly a a Yes supporter, and I will be encouraging people to go that way. But I'm always listening to everyone and I just certainly encourage that in this next six weeks in particular. But I do also want to just point out, just from a practical point of view, Katie, that the difference for the referendum is that we will start voting in about three weeks time (in the NT). So your listeners may want to really kind of put their skates on to ask the questions they need to ask. They're very welcome also to touch base with my office. You know, I just think this is critical. One of the great things the Australian Electoral Commission has done is to increase the participation on the electoral roll here in the Northern Territory, but even right across the country. So we've seen an uptick of up to nearly 97% of Australians on the electoral roll, which is huge. And here in the Northern Territory and a massive increase as well. And I'd just encourage, you know, people to get out and vote. That is a real important essence of democracy.
WOOLF: Malarndirri you know, a lot of what I hear from people who are saying, you know, they're going to vote 'no' is because they are worried that it's not going to make a difference. They're worried that it's only going to mean representation in Canberra. You know, I hear very often as well from people, you know, why do we need another sort of body when we've actually got really strong Indigenous voices already in Canberra in yourself, in Malarndirri McCarthy, in Jacinta Price, and of course Luke Gosling. You know, we've got four people who are standing up for the Northern Territory already, so there's some that are sort of saying, why do we need it?
MCCARTHY: Sure. And they're very fair questions katie and my response to that is this: Firstly, First Nations people came together at Uluru in 2017 and this was a request by them and their families and organizations that they represented. The continual change of government saw the continual change of policies. So what we're seeing on the ground now is more about the structural change of the Westminster system. This is what we're asking to improve the structural change of how that works in Canberra. And by that I mean, for example, we deal with issues here where we, you know, I often hear people say, you know, look at the homelessness and the people who are leaving their communities to come into town. And I look at that and I say, well, they don't actually have the opportunity to see change in their communities. And it's not just about the fact that I, you know, may not be or may be doing what I can or Senator Price may or may not be doing what she can or Luke Gosling, you know, the same thing. This is actually going to the heart of how First Nations people have not had the chance. And they don't have to be a part of a party to do that, to encourage and influence parliament decisions and to give advice. And can I just stress it is advice. You know, the parliament may or may not take that advice, but it will have to be accountable as to why it didn't. And there has to be that transparency. So we want to see the changes on the ground, you know, whether it's Labor in power, whether it's the Coalition in power or another party in power, the fact that the voice, if successful, is enshrined in the Constitution, then we will see the improvement in the lives of First Nations people across the country.
WOOLF: Malarndirri some sort of saying, you know, are we going to see the voice and that body then giving advice on things like, you know, defence and in areas where some may sort of think to themselves, well, is this going to slow? You know, is it going to slow the process right down and and do we need it? You know, so there are a lot of people sort of wondering whether it's going to be involved in areas that it potentially doesn't need to be.
MCCARTHY: If you look at the question that will be put and that question is on the website, it does focus on matters that impact First Nations people. And what we are looking at is around education, around housing, employment and health, so that so they are four key targeted areas. So I think, you know, to reassure your listeners, one of the things that I want to see is that these issues around closing the gap where we have high rates of suicide, high rates of incarceration. Babies are born underweight. I want to see that we we have to close that gap. And I don't want it to be a responsibility of the next generation of Australians or Territorians for that matter. I want the next generation to have their own problems. They should not be burdened with these issues and I am personally very strongly of the view that if we can see a change from a very structural point of view in the Westminster system of Parliament, then we will see a real improvement in the lives of First Nations people in this country and ultimately all of us.
WOOLF: What do you say to those people that you know, look at the voice and they say, Well, this isn't going to truly represent Aboriginal people in communities. It's going to be, you know, snobs in other locations, you know, and it's not going to be genuine Territorians. And look, I always find this interesting because I think, you know, if you look at us here in the Territory, we, you know, we have some of the we have some of the biggest issues in in terms of like you've touched on health, housing, domestic violence, crime, incarceration. There are so many different issues that we grapple with every day. But I guess what we really hate is Territorians as well is having someone who lives in Sydney or Canberra or wherever telling us how to do things and thinking that that's going to be better when we're experiencing it every day.
MCCARTHY: You have, if successful, Katie, and again, I've heard those, you know those questions as well raised, if successful in this referendum and it will be a tough referendum to win. I have no doubt about that. We will see the communities across the Northern Territory very fairly represented at the federal level. And you know why? Because we will ensure that the Northern Territory has a fair seat at the table and I think we've shown that through pushing to keep the seat of Lingiari for the Northern Territory so that we've had two federal seats and I sort of digressed slightly from that in the sense that representation has always been a critical focus of mine in terms of the Northern Territory.
WOOLF: Yeah, you and I have spoken about it before.
MCCARTHY: So I think that, you know, if I can certainly reassure your listeners that if we are successful in this, there is no doubt I will be pushing very hard for the fair representation of the territory.
WOOLF: Malarndirri I know that again, there's so many people who feel so differently about this and we'll make sure that we catch up with people from both sides, yes and no, as we definitely should. But, you know, I think that it is really important that we do obviously have that representation from the Northern Territory. You know, when you look at us all going to vote and you look at this referendum. How will you feel if it doesn't get up?
MCCARTHY: Well, I've approached this from the perspective of a bit like a grand final, Katie, I feel like we've been on this journey certainly since 2017, when I was in opposition as a senator and have only been in government for the last, you know, just over the last 12 months where we we've now determined to take this referendum forward to the people. And I feel that with the starters gun, we are now in the final quarter. And like any grand final, you stay focused on winning and giving it your best shot. What I'd love to see is that at the end of that grand final that we can still shake hands on the field.
WOOLF: I bloody hope so, because I just really don't want, you know, I don't want Australia to sort of be torn apart. Either way, no matter what happens. And I guess that's what I've probably found a bit upsetting over, you know, over the months is that you do you sort of hear some real, real nasty stuff from on both sides. And I just think that we're better than that as Australians. We are better than that.
MCCARTHY: Absolutely we are better than that. And can I just point out again, we're talking about an advisory committee, an advisory committee to the Parliament that's enshrined in the Constitution so that whatever political party gets into government, that advisory committee remains and continues on track to improve the lives of First Nations people. It really is as simple as that. I do urge all Territorians to get yourselves informed and actually to enjoy this time. It's very rare that we have referendums. I'm sure there's many people out there who probably are going to be voting for the first time in a referendum. You know, enjoy this time. It is beautiful and look at the fact that we are a democracy, our country is great. We just believe we can make it greater.