THOMAS ORITI: After more than eight months of back and forth Australians will today learn the date for the nation's historic Indigenous Voice to Parliament referendum. It's widely expected to be Saturday the October the 14th, but I guess we'll find out in the coming hours. People will be asked to vote either Yes or No to enshrine in your first nations Voice in the Constitution, if approved, it would establish an Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander formal body for Indigenous people to give advice on laws. And the polls will be open on voting day from 8am to 6pm local time in the weeks ahead. And as I say, more clarity on that today widely expected to be a mid-October date at this stage. Senator Malarndirri McCarthy is the Assistant Minister for Indigenous Australians, who joins us now from Adelaide. Senator, good morning to you.
SENATOR MALARNDIRRI MCCARTHY: Good morning Thomas and good morning to all your listeners, lovely to be here.
ORITI: Thanks very much for joining us, great to have you with us and on a busy day as well. You're going to be there in Adelaide, why is your Government making this announcement in South Australia today? What is it about South Australia?
MCCARTHY: Well look for me on a personal level, South Australia has been associated with the Northern Territory for as far back as I can remember. So it's a pivotal sort of relationship for us in the Territory. But I think more broadly, Thomas, it's also about the Constitution. You know, there have been significant changes here in South Australia Constitutionally, we've also had the Voice here in their Parliament recently, we also had the women's vote here in South Australia and I think Kaurna country really leads the way on so many Constitutional areas. But naturally, it's also an important one in terms of the vote.
ORITI: Yeah, that's what I was going to ask. I mean, obviously, there was a bit of strategy here, right? Is it fair enough to say South Australia is seen, glad you bury that at the end, South Australia is seen as a key battleground state in this though, isn't it?
MCCARTHY: Absolutely and South Australia is absolutely important to the vote, but so to are the states that we have to get in terms of the majority of states. So we're really leaving no stone unturned, Thomas, to be honest, and I'm thrilled that we are here and we're going to hear from the Prime Minister today on the matter.
ORITI: I mean, there's some new research out from the strategic insights business has found the majority of Australians are expecting and No outcome, I guess, regardless of which way they vote later this year and there has been a lot of talk about that, you know, support for the Voice has dropped off in the past few months. Has the Prime Minister waited too long to announce a date that sort of feeds into this narrative that there was concern that, you know, he needed more time to drum up some more support and that sort of uncertainty?
MCCARTHY: I can only speak from my view, as I've travelled to across Australia, Thomas and assess that referendums are tough. You know, it is really difficult. We knew that from the outset, in coming into this when we came into where Government and promised to go forward on a referendum. And I just say to Australian people that we will keep going right up until 6pm. on the ballot day, to encourage Australians to vote Yes. And to talk to them about why that's important.
ORITI: As you said, referendums are tough. There's that that double standard that it even needs to meet the majority of Australians in four out of the six states to even pass. I mean, some Australians that assumed perhaps this was going to be a bipartisan issue. But it's been a very divisive debate so far. I mean, genuinely, are you confident in the time between now on polling day, the Yes campaign can do enough to persuade those undecided voters? And it does sound like there's there are many, many undecided voters.
MCCARTHY: Look, I’m an absolutely strong supporter in terms of a Voice to be enshrined in the Constitution, I'm as much an advocate, passionate advocate, for democracy, Thomas, and one of the beautiful things about where we are in Australia at the moment is that people have a choice and people need to get themselves informed. We are in the final quarter. You know, I keep using the analogy of a bit of a grand-final, really, between Yes and No, and I just find it quite exciting. I think this is an incredibly important day today. The first of many, and whatever happens, I sincerely hope that all Australians will take part in the vote and do their democratic sort of process with going to the ballot box, please step forward and make sure you have your say, and, you know, let's hope we get the outcome that we would certainly like to see. Because we do believe that will be much better for our country, if we can see this go our way.
ORITI: With a footy analogy, at least we have some clarity, potentially, it's not going to clash with the Grand Finals, it was one of the promises of the Prime Minister. Just on that note, it's great to hear how diplomatic you are being there about the fact that this is democracy, and people have their say, but obviously as an Indigenous Australian, I mean, there are many Indigenous Australians who want the Yes vote to succeed, some who don't. We had one Warren Mundine on the program half an hour ago, of course. But are you concerned that the views from some and as this debate continues, that that could have a serious impact on the mental health of many Indigenous Australians?
MCCARTHY: I'm more excited now, Thomas, I feel that way we have been walking this journey, for many for decades, for others in terms of the Uluru Statements since 2017, we are on the cusp of creating history in our country in an incredibly positive way. And I'm very excited and hopeful and enthusiastic. I do see, however long this campaign is that the Prime Minister will announced today, an opportunity for our country to really, really do what we believe is best, and dig deep and create a better future for ourselves.
ORITI: Many people in remote communities and Indigenous Australians, though they've said they still don't have a good understanding of the Voice and how it'll work. We had a story a couple of days ago from Indigenous Australians who are deaf saying, ‘we have no idea what this is, nothing's been, you know, put into Auslan and Indigenous signing systems as well’, I mean, do you think that enough has been done to get that key messaging out to them at the moment? Because it does appear to be a crucial part of this narrative, people just don't know what this is.
MCCARTHY: We have to keep going and we have to keep reaching out, I thought it was really important to see the story that was on your program around Auslan. So naturally, we have to ensure that people can understand the messaging, whether they speak in Aboriginal language, whether they speak a multicultural language, we must ensure the translation is happening there. And I know I am, as I travel across regional remote parts of Australia, asking that. But I think this is what, when we go into this period, if you like of the formal campaign, this is where everyone has to step up into fifth gear, if you like, and really reach out every way we possibly can until 6pm on the ballot on the ballot day.
ORITI: Senator, can I just ask, because we did have Warren Mundine on the program half an hour ago, who, on behalf of No side, I just want to ask you about the point that he made because he's not opposed to the Voice necessarily, but he wants an Act of Parliament to establish, he doesn't want to embed it into the Constitution. The problem that he told me he has is the fact that that makes it permanent and it feeds into this idea that Indigenous Australians will always need help, you won't be able to remove it, they will always need help. I mean, does he have point about the optics of making this absolutely permanent in the Constitution, when perhaps legislation for the Voice could be pretty powerful as well?
MCCARTHY: Well, the permanency is why this is going to the Australian people, Thomas, the fact that for decades, if not over two hundred years, decisions have been made about Aboriginal people, for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people and not with them. And really, this is the critical juncture of where we disagree. That's why I'm on the Yes side and that's why Warren Mundine and others on the No side –
ORITI: But what is it to you, sorry to interrupt, but what is it to you about the importance of having it enshrined in the Constitution when the No side is saying, ‘hey, we can do this, but you can just get legislation to fix it and then it can be removed later?’
MCCARTHY: Unfortunately, that horse is bolted. The Coalition were in government for nine years and they refuse to do anything with the Uluru Statement from the Heart and yet it was under their watch from 2017, Thomas. So there can be no trust in that conversation anymore. And we, when we came to Parliament and came to Government last year, had taken it to the Australian people in the election, that we would follow through with the Uluru Statement from the Heart and that meant going to a referendum. And so we're following through on our word on that. And that's where we differ with Warren Mundine and the No camp.
ORITI: Senator before I let you go, and I know it's a busy day for you, but if the referendum returns a No vote, some commentators and in fact internationally, I was reading the New York Times, you know, they've written about how this could be Australia's Brexit moment. How do you think a No vote could potentially impact the political psyche of this country?
MCCARTHY: Well Thomas, I'll just say this, like any grand-final, you prepare to win and you prepare to go out there and be as fierce and ready as you can and reach out to as many people as you can and you stay focused on that, and that's exactly where I am right now.
ORITI: Love the footy analogies. Thank you very much. Thank you for joining us, Senator. Appreciate your time. As always.
MCCARTHY: No worries, Thomas. Thank you.