PATRICIA KARVELAS, HOST: I want to bring in the Assistant Minister for Employment, Patrick Gorman. Welcome to the program.
PATRICK GORMAN, ASSISTANT MINISTER TO THE PRIME MINISTER: Thanks, PK.
KARVELAS: David Jones employs more than 6,000 staff across a network of 38 stores. This is a dark day, isn't it?
GORMAN: It is. And one of their flagship stores is in my electorate of Perth. And I think about those workers who are at work right now, knowing that administrators are making very difficult decisions about the future of the business, which some of them have worked for, for decades. And so, like the Deputy Prime Minister has said today, I want to make sure that those workers are paramount in all of the considerations as the administrators do their work. We want to make sure that they are - wherever possible, jobs are protected, and of course, that workers get every cent of entitlements that they have earned.
KARVELAS: The National Secretary of the Union, the SDA, told the ABC earlier, the top priority was to retain as many jobs as possible. Is the Government making representations in this process, what does it look like?
GORMAN: Well, today I've spoken to both the SDA and heard what they have to say. And I really appreciate the work they're doing with their members. They have already been in communication with their membership. And I've also been working with the Department of Employment and Workplace Relations, making sure that we are reaching out to the administrators, looking at what is happening and also being careful not to pre-empt decisions from the administrators, but to make sure there's open dialogue. So that, very importantly, the workers who have been at the heart of this business - and for all of us who have fond memories of buying something from David Jones that was special or that we just still like and wear to this day.
I bought the suit that I wore on my wedding day from David Jones. I have very fond memories, and I hope that those fond memories aren't a thing of the past, but this business can find a path through to maintain the jobs for those who work for them. But also, to maintain the essential service of retail that they provide. So, we'll keep making sure those lines of communication are open and also set expectations high about how workers are treated through this process.
KARVELAS: The collapse really marks the first time David Jones has been in administration, but it's kind of weathered really, 200 - like a really long time of cycling through lots of different models. But this has happened and this is the political point on your government's watch. Do you take responsibility for the economic conditions that have led to this?
GORMAN: We are a government that does take responsibility, just as I take responsibility for the social safety net that our government has continued to strengthen since we came into office. But I would note that the changes with David Jones - I think it came off the stock market in 2014, it went to the South African owned Woolworths Holdings. They owned it for a period. It was sold to private equity. It has been through quite a journey.
And you can look back at articles, including on the ABC, that refer to concerns about the stability of this company for a long period of time. While I recognise there are administrators in right now, I don't want to call time on this company. I have great faith the administrators can do the best of their work to make sure they protect jobs and protect a brand that is well loved by many Australians. Even though we do acknowledge that the nature of retail, in not just Australia, but around the world is changing. And it's a big challenge for many companies, big and small, to keep up with those changing consumer practices.
KARVELAS: Yeah, but I suppose the question is, has that accelerated under the Albanese Government's watch. Because people have less disposable income than ever, and retail really relies on people having disposable income. People don't have it, they're poorer. Interest rates have gone up for the fifth time this year. Isn't that part of the story?
GORMAN: What you outline in terms of what's happening with interest rates is a fact and I don't deny it and I acknowledge it. I acknowledge the hurt that it is causing for particularly mortgage holders. But I also want to acknowledge the work that we've done to make sure that we're getting more money into the pockets of Australians and Australian consumers. We have been really proud and really clear that getting wages up has been a core economic policy of our government.
Angus Taylor, who we heard from just a moment ago, didn't support those wage increases and indeed he's out there now saying he's going to wind back wage increases that we've committed to for aged care, child care. We will continue to look for ways to help people earn more because we recognise that is one of the best ways to support small business and to support the many thousands of jobs in big businesses, including retail.
KARVELAS: The Opposition Leader said, "the truth is, David Jones has seen through two world wars and a depression, but it looks like it's not going to see through the Albanese Government." What's your response to that political rebuke? And it's not just from him. One Nation has gone pretty hard on this as well.
GORMAN: If Angus Taylor wants to also be open about some of the impacts of what happened during COVID when he was in government and some of the pressures that that put on parts of the retail sector. I would welcome that honest reflection from him.
The reality is that this business has been under pressure for a long time. We saw the decline in value from what Woolworths South Africa paid for it through to what they then sold it for. Significant decline in value. Most of that happened over the Coalition's watch. But I don't think any of that point scoring helps. The workers who today are standing in stores across Australia wondering what is happening with their jobs and entitlements. That is my focus right now and I think that's where the focus of the Australian Government needs to be.
KARVELAS: Just finally, you're a Western Australian MP. Woodside will cut more than 500 jobs and increase its use of artificial intelligence. That's a move that hits workers. Doesn't it show that AI is displacing workers?
GORMAN: Well, look, I think it's pretty disappointing for Woodside. They have got profits going up and up and up. And then at the same time they're finding any excuse they can to cut workers. I mean, a lot of those workers are in my electorate. Woodside's headquarters is in my electorate. And I recognise that there are people who will be going home today without a job or knowing that that information is going to be hitting them soon in an inbox. And so it's a really tough time.
I do think - I've got to say this about Woodside. I think they've made some mistakes. It wasn't that long ago they said they were going to start investing in renewable energy, some $5 billion package they announced. They sat in my office here in Canberra. Told me what a great investment it was going to be. Then they pulled all of that investment and now we're seeing Woodside cut jobs, a significant part of their workforce.
I'm pretty sceptical about what Woodside's doing at the moment and I think they've really stretched their social licence and this really compounds that.
KARVELAS: Thank you so much for joining us.
GORMAN: Thank you.