TOM CONNELL, HOST: Joining me now, we've got Assistant Minister to the Prime Minister, Patrick Gorman and former New South Wales Liberal Party President and MP Jason Falinski, thanks both for your time. Pat, down now in Newspoll. When do you panic?
PATRICK GORMAN, ASSISTANT MINISTER TO THE PRIME MINISTER: Tom, you just go and you put out your case for election. That's what you do. There's going to be polls of individual seats, of the nation, all the rest. What we know is that when the election comes, it will be a choice between our plans for the future or Peter Dutton's lack of plans for the future. That's what it's going to come down to. I mean, think about housing. We talk a lot about housing. We've got a $32 billion plan. Peter Dutton's only housing plan is to get himself into the Lodge. I think the Australian people are really going to start to question whether Mr. Dutton and his Liberal Party actually have any policies that will take Australia forward. And I think if anything comes out of this Newspoll, people will start to ask tough questions of Peter Dutton, and where are his fully costed policies? Even Tony Abbott used to run around saying he had fully costed policies. Peter Dutton doesn't even do that.
CONNELL: Well, I'm not sure he did it a few months out from the election, I don't know. I think the Newspoll might be reverberating a bit amongst your colleagues. Jason, what do you make of the Coalition's primary vote? It's sort of not moving a little bit over the last two or three surveys. Does Peter Dutton need to make a bit of a pivot? You know, step one in Opposition, bring the government's standing down, which he's managed to do pretty well. Does he need a bit of a pivot, though?
JASON FALINSKI, FORMER NSW LIBERAL PARTY PRESIDENT: Look, Tom, undoubtedly, between now and the election, Peter Dutton and his team will be talking about what their solutions to the problems of housing, the cost of energy, the union-inspired decline in real wages, which is the fastest and biggest in the world. They're all serious things. I mean, what this Newspoll reflects is that eventually reality catches up with your rhetoric. And what we have here in Australia at the moment is our biggest deficit isn't fiscal, it's now a deficit of trust.
CONNELL: Alright, so in terms of the sort of pivot, though, what does it come in, does it - I mean, how much of this is the personal and him? I know he once said he'd smile a bit more. He does this Friday morning banter on a competing network, I'll say. But otherwise is pretty, sort of steadfast and sort of serious. Does he need to pivot a little bit in his personality? Or am I not getting serious enough about politics when I talk about personality?
FALINSKI: Look, I think that that's a bit unfair, to be honest with you. I think that most, I mean Peter Dutton just needs to be Peter Dutton. And people will see that, you know, he's got certainty of ideas. If Peter decides to do something, he'll do it. I think one of the greatest complaints that Australians have about Prime Ministers is they say one thing and then do another. You're not going to get that with Peter Dutton and, look Tom, as much as you're saying he's undermining the credibility of this Government -
GORMAN: - But he's not saying what he's going to do, Jason. He's not saying anything, he's got no policies.
FALINSKI: Well, I think that's a bit rich coming from a member of the Labor Party, who spent two years, 11 months and 29 days not telling us what they were going to do, and on the eve of the election, said, 'oh, by the way, we're going to make reconciliation one of our core programs for the next term.' So look, I don't think that it's fair of the Labor Party to say that. You will get more policies out of Peter Dutton than you ever got out of the Anthony Albanese-led Opposition.
GORMAN: I won't hold my breath.
CONNELL: There's a bit to come, to shake out but yeah, that doesn't strike me as a small target so far, especially when you're going so hard at nuclear, which is a - you know, whatever you think of it - it's a very different policy. What about free lunches? Now, I don't want you to, you know, talk about this as a parent, Patrick, because we'd all love to just go sending the kids to school, and I don't even have to make a lunch they're going to complain in about about six hours time. But how much can Queensland just shovel money out the door? This is getting wild, isn't it?
GORMAN: I think what we're seeing from state governments across the country is they're all looking at different ways of addressing cost of living pressures that families face. This is a big, innovative policy from Steven Miles and the Labor team. I wish them all the best for their election in just under two weeks from now, and I think you're right, Tom, a lot of parents would like to find a way to not have to spend a few minutes packing the lunch box in the morning. Also probably enjoy the savings that come about for that and obviously, you know, I've seen different food relief programs in my electorate trying to make sure that children aren't disadvantaged in their learning because of the economic circumstance of their parents. I recognise that this comes from a really good place, but I'm also conscious that it's an idea that's going to be taken to an election. I do note, though, that on the 50 cent fares that the Miles Government introduced a little while back, the Liberal Party and the National Party, bashed that idea. They said it was terrible, it was a waste of money, and then they went and backed it in, and now they're saying they're going to do it. So I'll be interested to see what the Liberal National Party say in the days ahead.
CONNELL: They seem to think it might not be affordable. One of the lunch bags you had up had up had a plastic water bottle, which just staggers me. Guess what? We've got drinkable water in Australia. Let's have that. Anyway, there's my rant. Jason, I'm feeling very chuffed about this area because sometimes I'm sort of figuring out if the old pancakes sitting in the fridge are moldy or not, to send them off to my young ones' lunch, and today I put in homemade banana cake. I didn't make it, but that's not the point. How do you feel about this policy? Godsend to parents? Is it going to be just the LNP saying, 'oh, we better do this too, we're about to win an election?'
FALINSKI: Well, Tom up until this moment, I was against this policy, but now that I realise your children may be forced to eat banana bread made by you, I can see that it makes a lot of sense. I mean, look, government is not the solution. Government is the problem. I mean, what next? Are we going to have government funded nannies coming in to make sure that our children brush their teeth? We have serious problems in this country that require serious politicians and serious political leaders, our education standards have fallen over the last decade under both parties, Tom, so I'm not having a political go. And policies that are designed to arrest that decline in education standards would be something that I would think the people who want to be the Premier of Queensland should be spending time on, not gimmicks like $1.4 billion for a free lunch. This is just, it's silly, it's trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist when there are actually real problems that do.
CONNELL: I know some states, for example, have programs for kids who are not getting a proper breakfast at home. Is that something? You know, and that's targeted, that's however many kids get it in the morning. It's not just every single student getting a free lunch. Can you see a need for that where parents are not actually giving their kids proper food in the morning versus the whole state?
FALINSKI: Yeah, so, so as you know, Tom, I'm a huge fan of academies and chartered schools, and some of the academies in the UK and chartered schools in the US, specifically aim - some of their charter is literally to ensure that students get three meals a day, because that has a actual impact on the capacity of a child to learn. So in those underprivileged areas where people don't have, who are coming from chaotic home lives, where the school can step in to make sure that they're getting the best opportunity or life forward. That makes, that makes absolute sense, those targeted programs.
CONNELL: Okay, so targeted. So Jason's giving me an idea, Patrick. Cleaning teeth, that's, that's, that's ridiculous, frankly, a nanny to send someone round to clean the teeth. But bedtime, gee, I'd take that up. Is there any spare money in the budget? Bedtime nannies? Maybe, look, I'll take one or two days a week. Or maybe you can, you know, if it's been more than an hour, you hit the alarm, you say 'ah, the federal government's nanny's going to come around.' That might work.
GORMAN: I think Tony Abbott experimented with having Commonwealth-funded nannies, and it didn't work out too well for him. Our focus when it comes to the Commonwealth investing in the welfare of the next generation is, of course, in making sure that we give early childhood educators the pay rise they deserve. That's going to kick in in December, and at the same time, we're putting a cap on childcare fees. That's probably where we'll keep our focus, Tom, but if you've got any ideas, you're more than welcome to write to your local federal member.
CONNELL: That's my best one. I feel like it's, yeah, it's Jason's fault. Once you mentioned the school lunches, I'm just letting it all out. I've had a bit of one of those mornings. All right. Final, final moment. I haven't told you about this one, but we've got a few seconds left. How did you entertain the kids during school holidays? Jason, you can go first.
FALINSKI: I just over-program lessons. From surfing to tennis, to you know that will go. Simply put: exhaustion. Just exhaust them so they have anything else to do.
CONNELL: Send them out. Get them out of your hands. Yes, yep, Patrick, I'm over time, so just be, just be short for me.
GORMAN: Oh, look. I'll just say that grandparents are some of the greatest people on Earth. And thanks to all of the grandparents out there.
FALINSKI: Hear, hear, Patrick.
CONNELL: You've given the same answer. Basically, you sent them anywhere but yourselves. All right, Jason, Patrick, thank you. We'll talk again soon.